[OZAPRS] on density and stomping

vk2tv vk2tv at exemail.com.au
Tue Nov 7 12:56:37 AEDT 2017


I got it

I got it

I got it

Mmm, one of my replies is missing.


On 07/11/17 12:29, Scott Evans wrote:
>
> He Ray it's like...
>
> Here's a joke about UDP.
> Did you get it?
> Did you get it?
> Did you get it?
> Did you get it?
>
>
> On Tue., 7 Nov. 2017, 12:18 vk2tv, <vk2tv at exemail.com.au 
> <mailto:vk2tv at exemail.com.au>> wrote:
>
>     All aprs is UI mode, there's no connected mode (with ACK,RR, RNR,
>     etc) as we relate it to packet.
>
>     My restricted experience with aprs messaging is it's very much hit
>     and miss but maybe that's a network fault rather than the aprs
>     protocol. Still, I like the connected mode aspect of packet for
>     confidence.
>
>     Ray vk2tv
>
>
>     On 07/11/17 10:58, Glen English VK1XX wrote:
>>     agreed
>>
>>     Like for the person looking at their D700 to see what is going on.
>>
>>     They almost need a specific download channel. IE outbound only feed with
>>     continuous regional position updates on it.
>>
>>     Surely all station to station messaging is connected mode ?
>>
>>     As a single UI message might as well be transmitted into a dummy load.
>>     Or is there a protocol wrapped around UI ?
>>
>>
>>
>>     On 7/11/2017 10:52 AM, Matthew Cook wrote:
>>>     One of the downsides of multiple RX only iGates as has been found in
>>>     Adelaide recently is they only benefit internet based observers.
>>>
>>>     You also loose capabilities like two way messaging and create
>>>     confusion as to where users are with internet to RF gateways and delays.
>>>
>>>     There's been a few times recently where users have messaged me over
>>>     APRS in Adelaide that was gated to the net by a RX only iGate that was
>>>     then fired back onto RF, only for my reply to never be received.
>>>
>>>     A well designed Wide2-n network with good coverage and Wide1-n's to
>>>     over come terrain issues sounds like a good plan and a lot of fun.
>>>
>>>     73
>>>
>>>     Matthew
>>>     VK5ZM
>>>
>>>     On 7 November 2017 at 08:14, Glen English VK1XX
>>>     <glenlist at pacificmedia.com.au <mailto:glenlist at pacificmedia.com.au>  <mailto:glenlist at pacificmedia.com.au>
>>>     <mailto:glenlist at pacificmedia.com.au>>
>>>     wrote:
>>>
>>>          Hi Ray
>>>
>>>          The stomping is a good point.  it's sort of like having a diversity
>>>          receiver. Instead of an RF fade, we have channel contention.
>>>          Actually,
>>>          in theory, multiple I-gate RX around town in a  dense area can provide
>>>          an increase in traffic density capability, as the n signals will
>>>          compete
>>>          at different sites and some will win/loose  due to terrain
>>>          shielding and
>>>          also flat fading short delay multipath.
>>>
>>>          Since too many I gates is no problem, Ginini will have Igate as
>>>          well as
>>>          RF forwarding. The 50kbps half duplex IP link will carry that no
>>>          problem.
>>>
>>>          Being open source code, we can add / modify as required. Isaacs
>>>          will be
>>>          identical HW eventually.
>>>
>>>          glen
>>>
>>>          On 7/11/2017 8:14 AM, vk2tv wrote:
>>>          >
>>>          > Glen
>>>          >
>>>          > I wasn't thinking of the digi only responding to its real
>>>          callsign, it
>>>          > will do that in any case AFAIK. I was thinking of the case where
>>>          > (local) users specify the digis real callsign in their path to keep
>>>          > their traffic "local".
>>>          >
>>>          > There's a lot of discussion about rgi and possible effects of
>>>          outbound
>>>          > traffic from it but we also need to consider the benefits of
>>>          having a
>>>          > well-sited W2-1 (say) Igate to respond to inbound traffic that might
>>>          > have been stomped on at another system(s).
>>>          >
>>>          > Ray vk2tv
>>>          >
>>>          >
>>>          >
>>>          > On 06/11/17 20:18, Glen English VK1XX wrote:
>>>          >> yeah, I would guess addr, WIDE1-1, VK1RGI-1 would do it
>>>          >>
>>>          >> another thing to change on the client .
>>>          >>
>>>          >> again, pity more cannot be gleaned by the digi beacon.
>>>          >>
>>>          >> alternatively, the system could have a list of locals...
>>>          >>
>>>          >> cheers
>>>          >>
>>>          >>
>>>          >>
>>>          >> On 6/11/2017 6:36 PM, vk2tv wrote:
>>>          >>> Doesn't the aprs specification provide for a station to direct
>>>          traffic
>>>          >>> via a specific digi callsign instead of the generic WIDEx-x to
>>>          >>> minimise spread?
>>>          >>>
>>>          >>> Ray vk2tv
>>>          >>>
>>>          >>>
>>>          >>> On 06/11/17 18:03, Glen English VK1XX wrote:
>>>          >>>> All
>>>          >>>>
>>>          >>>> thanks Josh,Ian, Dom, Ray for the inputs, and asking me good
>>>          questions
>>>          >>>> for me to think about.
>>>          >>>>
>>>          >>>> I'll read a bit more into USA centric & written articles.
>>>          >>>>
>>>          >>>> I think I will filter 1RBM (local cbr) and 1RGI from duplicating
>>>          >>>> everything. Or at least have a think about it. There really
>>>          needs to be
>>>          >>>> a setup for users if they really do want 1RGI is digipeat
>>>          their 1RBM
>>>          >>>> UIs. I guess that's what WIDE2-2 is for.
>>>          >>>>
>>>          >>>> Also got to think of the reverse case... RBM hearing things
>>>          that I
>>>          >>>> expect Ginini to hear and not . That of course can happen any
>>>          time for a
>>>          >>>> mobile station, long and short delay multipath abundant.
>>>          >>>>
>>>          >>>> In about 90% of canberra cases, 1RGI will hear whatever 1RBM
>>>          hears no
>>>          >>>> problem...
>>>          >>>>
>>>          >>>> There there is the providing redundancy issue for other
>>>          paths.  Ether
>>>          >>>> way, IP link and full control will make things flexible.
>>>          >>>>
>>>          >>>> There's a double edge sword with terminals being dumb /simple
>>>          and say
>>>          >>>> unable to update their paths based on whatever they are
>>>          hearing- there
>>>          >>>> would be usefulness I would have thought in having the digi
>>>          beacon spit
>>>          >>>> out some useful information for UI stations.... or maybe
>>>          there has been
>>>          >>>> thought and it didnt catch on.
>>>          >>>>
>>>          >>>> I'll put UHF on the second sound card/dire wolf TNC channel,
>>>          that will
>>>          >>>> be useful.
>>>          >>>>
>>>          >>>> -glen
>>>          >>>>
>>>          >>>>
>>>          >>>>
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