[OZAPRS] European v USnewparadigmand pathlimiting +confusion....

Tue Nov 7 11:56:20 EST 2006

On Tue, 07 Nov 2006 11:28:25 +1100, Robert Bruninga <bruninga at usna.edu>  
wrote:

>> I think Bob summed it up here
>>
>> >The SSn-N is for organizing APRS communications networks
>> >around specific organized communication areas and needs....
>
> Yes, ZONES...
>
> But zones based on any existing "organizational" boundaries
> between communications organizations.  These Ham radio
> communiations organizations usually match perfectly with the
> government or public service sector that those volunteer
> organizations support.  So again, don't tie them to geographic
> boundaries necessarily, but to "comm" boundaries between those
> areas who form-up as nets when emergency communications are
> needed.
>
> Again, we call them SSn-N because most ham radio emergency and
> public service response nets and teams are organized at the
> State level in the USA (or smaller for larger states), but if
> you make sure that your zones match your COMMS organizations
> coverage areas, then that is the intent of the SSn-N system.
> EXAMPLE:  This is so that someone in the ZZZ zone can check in
> with APRS to the ZZZ area net using ZZZ5-5 hops that is called
> up every Tuesday night at 8 PM... For example, without QRMing
> the entire country.
>
> Lets say it takes 5 hops to go from one end of a zone to the
> other.  Then users in the middle of that zone only need to use
> the path of ZZZ3-3.  But those people on the edges may have to
> use ZZZ5-5 to cover the zone.  But this is far different from
> using WIDE5-5 which goes 5 hops in ALL directions instead of
> just inward to the ZZZ zone.  That is the advantage of ZZZn-N
> routing.  An order of magnitude reduction in QRM during these
> events.
>
> Now consider this!  Since the objective of ZZZ3-3 in the center,
> or ZZZ5-5 from someone on the edge of the zone is to hit all the
> digis in the zone, then there really is no difference between
> ZZ3-3, or ZZZ5-5 or ZZZ7-7 for that matter.  It is still going
> to hit every digi and that is the intent of this ZONE system.
> So, for these ZONE wide nets, then ZZZ7-7 is no different.  That
> too is the advantage of the ZZZn-N system, in that all QRM (if
> abused) stays in the ZONE.
>

Thats a point I've tried to make before, but you do it so much better!

> Again, ZZZ7-7 or 5-5 is NOT used routinely, it is only for
> specific purposes within that ZONE.  But when it is used in a
> ZONE WIDE net, then that is the only time that statiosn use the
> larger hops above say ZZZ3-3 or so.  But it is OK to use ZZZ2-2
> routinely if there is an advantage to it over WIDE2-2...
>
> One LAST thing:
>
> Since the New-N paradigm makes WIDEn-N traceable by using the
> UITRACE parameter, this means that the ZZZn-N system used the
> UIFLOOD parameter that is NOT traceable.  This is a
> disadvantage.  But here is the workaround.  If UIFLOOD in the
> DIGI's (KPC-3+ TNC's) is set to UIFLOOD ZZZ,30,ID then this
> forces at least the LAST digi to insert its call.  Now then, if
> the users use ZZZ1-1,ZZZn-N you get a packt that will arrive
> everywhere with at least its FIRST and its LAST digi identified.
> These two are most of what you need.  So a ZZZ1-1,ZZZ3-3 packet
> would arrive like this:
>
> ZZZ1-1,ZZZ3-3  as heard direct
> DIGI1,ZZZ1*,ZZZ3-3 heard via DIGI1
> DIGI1,ZZZ1,DIGI2*,ZZZ3-2 heard via DIGI1 and DIGI2
> DIGI1,ZZZ1,DIGI3*,ZZZ3-1 heard via DIGI1 and ??? and DIGI3
> DIGI1,ZZZ1,DIGI4,ZZZ3*   heard via DIGI1 and ???,??? and DIGI4
>
> If you don't use the initial ZZZ1-1, you never get the first
> digi identified...
>
> Now, only the KPC-3+ TNC does this correctly,  If you use an
> older KPC-3 with only version 8.2, then it can be made to work,
> but takes some other settings at the digi.  I have no clue
> whether Australia uses KPC3's anyway, so I will stop here until
> I learn more...
>

In the north of Tasmania we use UI-Digi.  In the south I think they use a

combination of other things.  I intend to try a X-Digi soon.

Thanks Bob,
Dion.

> Bob, WB4APR
>
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: ozaprs-bounces at aprs.net.au
>> [mailto:ozaprs-bounces at aprs.net.au] On Behalf Of Andrew McDade
>> Sent: Monday, November 06, 2006 5:43 PM
>> To: VK / ZL APRS Users
>> Subject: Re: [OZAPRS] European v USnewparadigmand
>> pathlimiting +confusion....
>>
>> Gday all,
>>
>> I think Bob summed it up here
>>
>> >The SSn-N is for organizing APRS
>> >communications networks around specific organized
> communication
>> >areas and needs.  Not specifically geographic areas.
>>
>> Perhaps referring to this as SSn-n is causing some confusion.
>> Id prefer it to be referred to as ZONEn-n. And be based on a
>> setup whereby the first 4 letters of the major centre
>> containing the zone ( regions ) igate is the path ie. MILDn-n
>> = Mildura. LINCn-n = Port Llincoln, GAMBn-n = Mt Gambier, and
>> so on. In Tasmania for example , instead of using TASn-n ,
>> perhaps we should use HOBAn-n or NTASn-n or STASn-n, If this
>> zone covers the whole of a state then well be it. This will
>> at least then head towards developing some sort of
>> commonality between all states.
>>
>> And to summarize Dion ...
>>
>> This is the most important point !!
>>  >think its these differences that need to be sorted, like
>> the confused
>> >operator in the next message asks, which path will work?  If
>> we could all
>> >settle on one configuration, this confusion would be
>> eliminated.  Mobiles
>> >that stay close to home would/could use SS1-1,SS2-2.
>> Roaming mobiles
>> >would use WIDE1-1,WIDE2-2..  I think the US example is
>> excellent, it
>> >simplifies everything.
>>
>> Seems simple enough to me !!
>>
>> Only point here is perhaps we should refer to this as ZONEn-n
>> instead of SSn-n. What to you think ?
>>
>> Regards .. Andrew .. VK5EX
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>
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