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    <p><font face="Arial">Glen,<br>
      </font></p>
    <p><font face="Arial">Being Brisbane it would have been 25kv, they
        never had a 1500V system although that voltage was discussed on
        two occasions but never adopted.</font><br>
    </p>
    Ray vk2tv<br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 08/12/17 19:18, Glen English VK1XX
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
      cite="mid:67b03aa9-fb9c-371e-3b40-f0ba0a1e264f@pacificmedia.com.au">Ian
      was it 1500V overhead, or the now days 25kVAC ?
      <br>
      <br>
      <br>
      On 8/12/2017 6:32 PM, Ian Bennett wrote:
      <br>
      <blockquote type="cite">I remember back in the 80's when I was in
        uniform and in Brisbane, a radio vehicle drove over the railway
        line near Enoggera with the HF whip still up. Made a BIG flash
        (apparently), blew a tyre, shutdown the train network for an
        hour or so and welded the 106 to it's mount.
        <br>
        I have two HF whips mounted on the bullbar of my 100 Series; my
        home made APRS antenna is just shy of 2m long (that was the
        length of the donor antenna that I dismantled) and is 3150(ish)
        mm floor to tip. I haven't had any dramas like the one mentioned
        above however I tie them back when negotiating "tight" spaces.
        <br>
        Will be a different story when we get our truck based motorhome
        but I have a cunning plan for that ;-)
        <br>
        <br>
        Ian
        <br>
        <br>
        On 08/12/17 17:39, Mathew McKernan wrote:
        <br>
        <blockquote type="cite">I did similar with a Codan autotune on
          my Landcruiser, mounted above the spare wheel carrier
          connected to my Codan 9323.
          <br>
          <br>
          <br>
          Hit the line at the same spot... was waiting for smoke to fill
          the cabin. I was pleased it didn't, but disappointed as it
          would have been pretty impressive!
          <br>
          <br>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
          <br>
          *From:* OZAPRS <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ozaprs-bounces@aprs.net.au"><ozaprs-bounces@aprs.net.au></a> on behalf of
          Glen English VK1XX <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:glenlist@pacificmedia.com.au"><glenlist@pacificmedia.com.au></a>
          <br>
          *Sent:* Friday, 8 December 2017 5:26:29 PM
          <br>
          *To:* <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:ozaprs@aprs.net.au">ozaprs@aprs.net.au</a>
          <br>
          *Subject:* Re: [OZAPRS] On possibilities with short HF whips
          <br>
          what are the recommendations and user practical limits for
          Melbourne ?
          <br>
          (trams)
          <br>
          <br>
          Canberra here you'll  get into trouble ~ 4m
          <br>
          <br>
          I had the loop on my vehicle when I was driving in Melbourne a
          fair bit....
          <br>
          <br>
          I once hit a tram line with my car roof antenna heatshrink
          insulated
          <br>
          helical at Racecourse Road, Kensington... it made a huge pop
          in the
          <br>
          receiver but otherwise no damage...
          <br>
          <br>
          <br>
          <br>
          <br>
          On 8/12/2017 3:07 PM, Matthew Cook wrote:
          <br>
          <blockquote type="cite">This is also worth considering when
            looking at larger HF whips.
            <br>
            <br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/business-industry/heavy-vehicles/road-access/restricted-access-vehicles/4-6m-high.html">http://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/business-industry/heavy-vehicles/road-access/restricted-access-vehicles/4-6m-high.html</a>
            <br>
            <br>
            Each state has their own variations to the above, nationally
            un-restricted is 4.3m.
            <br>
            <br>
            73
            <br>
            <br>
            Matthew
            <br>
            VK5ZM
            <br>
            <br>
            On 8 December 2017 at 14:03, Graeme <<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:graeme@abrona.com.au">graeme@abrona.com.au</a>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:graeme@abrona.com.au"><mailto:graeme@abrona.com.au></a>> wrote:
            <br>
            <br>
                 Thanks Glen.
            <br>
            <br>
                 Obviously my decision against buying a 2.2m centre
            loaded 40m whip
            <br>
                 because it would bend in the wind to its disadvantage
            in favour of
            <br>
                 a base loaded 1.4m whip wasn't a good one for multiple
            reasons.
            <br>
            <br>
                 Graeme 2HFG
            <br>
            <br>
                 -----Original Message----- From: Glen English VK1XX
            <br>
                 Sent: Friday, December 8, 2017 10:19 AM
            <br>
                 To: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:ozaprs@aprs.net.au">ozaprs@aprs.net.au</a>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ozaprs@aprs.net.au"><mailto:ozaprs@aprs.net.au></a>
            <br>
                 Subject: Re: [OZAPRS] On possibilities with short HF
            whips
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
                 Ran some NR predictions for 10 MHz for Brisbane Sydney,
            and 7 and 3.5
            <br>
            <br>
                 and also some more details calcs on the Diamond 1.4m
            logn base
            <br>
                 loaded whip
            <br>
            <br>
                 turns out to be ~ 3% efficiency.
            <br>
            <br>
                 for the -15dBi TX terminal (1.4m base loaded whip with
            suboptimal
            <br>
                 loading Q)
            <br>
            <br>
                 yep,  in daytime, single hop 750-1200km , 100W into the
            antenna,
            <br>
                 expect
            <br>
                 around 15dB SNR for the 300 baud modem given a good
            receiver
            <br>
                 antenna and
            <br>
                 setup...with a modem like DireWolf that can cope with
            frequency
            <br>
                 variations. Be sure you know your radio frequency
            offset before
            <br>
                 you start.
            <br>
            <br>
                 with same length whip on 7 MHz, expect about 300-700km
            in
            <br>
                 daylight, but
            <br>
                 not much use outside that time and distance.
            <br>
            <br>
                 All of this means is for 300 baud FSK packet mode and
            100W, the
            <br>
                 mode is
            <br>
                 unsuitable for low efficiency mobile antennas like base
            loaded short
            <br>
                 whips. (3% or less efficiency at 10 MHz, 2% at 7 MHz
            etc)
            <br>
            <br>
                 All this points to: (in my opinion) needing  a
            >=2.2m long whip
            <br>
                 instead
            <br>
                 of a 1.4m long whip.
            <br>
                 and  an antenna with a non base loaded structure (for
            300 baud packet)
            <br>
            <br>
                 Get your antenna efficiency up to 10% at 7 MHz and then
            now you
            <br>
                 have an
            <br>
                 idea setup 24 hours, single freq .... 10 MHz almost
            good enough except
            <br>
                 for the wee hours 2am-sunrise when you will be asleep
            anyway.
            <br>
            <br>
                 So the lesson here, 300 baud packet needs decent
            antenna efficiencies
            <br>
                 mobile.
            <br>
                 hence the need for a mode that does about 6dB better
            <br>
            <br>
                 sure we can do alot better than 6dB, but 6dB better
            mode is what is
            <br>
                 required to work on the 1.4m base loaded whips.
            <br>
            <br>
                 Otherwise for 300 baud FSk packet, it needs to be
            teamed up with
            <br>
                 antenna
            <br>
                 efficiency >= 8%, implying  something with a
            feedpoint of around 2
            <br>
                 ohms
            <br>
                 Rr and not too lossy loading and matching... a whip of
            2 meters
            <br>
                 tall  at
            <br>
                 10 MHz with continuous or 1/3 loaded structure. Base
            loaded structures
            <br>
                 are the worst !
            <br>
            <br>
                 The longer 1.8m long CB helical whips are a bit hard to
            find these
            <br>
                 days.
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
                 g
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
                 On 7/12/2017 6:36 PM, Glen English VK1XX wrote:
            <br>
            <br>
                     ok
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
                     On 7/12/2017 6:24 PM, <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:vk4tec@tech-software.net">vk4tec@tech-software.net</a>
            <br>
                     <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:vk4tec@tech-software.net"><mailto:vk4tec@tech-software.net></a> wrote:
            <br>
            <br>
                         You are not telling me anything new
            <br>
            <br>
                         -----Original Message-----
            <br>
                         From: OZAPRS [<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:ozaprs-bounces@aprs.net.au">mailto:ozaprs-bounces@aprs.net.au</a>
            <br>
                         <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ozaprs-bounces@aprs.net.au"><mailto:ozaprs-bounces@aprs.net.au></a>] On
            Behalf Of Glen
            <br>
                         English VK1XX
            <br>
                         Sent: Thursday, 7 December 2017 5:10 PM
            <br>
                         To: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:ozaprs@aprs.net.au">ozaprs@aprs.net.au</a>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ozaprs@aprs.net.au"><mailto:ozaprs@aprs.net.au></a>
            <br>
                         Subject: Re: [OZAPRS] Hf gates CD
            <br>
            <br>
                         base station 700-1500km away will hear you, but
            you wont
            <br>
                         hear a station 50km away.
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
                         On 7/12/2017 5:57 PM, <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:vk4tec@tech-software.net">vk4tec@tech-software.net</a>
            <br>
                         <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:vk4tec@tech-software.net"><mailto:vk4tec@tech-software.net></a> wrote:
            <br>
            <br>
                             Go for a walk
            <br>
            <br>
                             -----Original Message-----
            <br>
                             From: OZAPRS
            [<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:ozaprs-bounces@aprs.net.au">mailto:ozaprs-bounces@aprs.net.au</a>
            <br>
                             <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ozaprs-bounces@aprs.net.au"><mailto:ozaprs-bounces@aprs.net.au></a>]
            On Behalf Of Glen
            <br>
                             English VK1XX
            <br>
                             Sent: Thursday, 7 December 2017 4:55 PM
            <br>
                             To: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:ozaprs@aprs.net.au">ozaprs@aprs.net.au</a>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ozaprs@aprs.net.au"><mailto:ozaprs@aprs.net.au></a>
            <br>
                             Subject: Re: [OZAPRS] Hf gates CD
            <br>
            <br>
                             tracker might well have CD but:
            <br>
            <br>
                             1) Consider that in the mobile, you wont
            hear any
            <br>
                             stations less than the skip distance
            (unless they are
            <br>
                             10km away) . The daytime skip distance
            might be
            <br>
                             700km.... so anyone inside that distance
            you wont
            <br>
                             hear  cause the ionosphere wont support
            it..it wont
            <br>
                             support any angles higher than perhaps 45
            degrees.
            <br>
            <br>
                             The base station though will hear lots of
            <br>
                             transmissions from lots of stations
            >700km  to 1500km
            <br>
                             away, so there would be significant
            collision chance
            <br>
                             if the position update is too often. Maybe
            10 minutes
            <br>
                             might be suitable. I dunno why people run..
            <br>
            <br>
                             2) With a 5%  to 10%  efficiency mobile you
            wont hear
            <br>
                             too much unless the propagation is
            optimal...
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
                             glen
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
                             On 7/12/2017 5:41 PM,
            <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:vk4tec@tech-software.net">vk4tec@tech-software.net</a>
            <br>
                             <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:vk4tec@tech-software.net"><mailto:vk4tec@tech-software.net></a>
            wrote:
            <br>
            <br>
                                 Blind ?
            <br>
            <br>
                                 Tracker has CD
            <br>
            <br>
                                 -----Original Message-----
            <br>
                                 From: OZAPRS
            [<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:ozaprs-bounces@aprs.net.au">mailto:ozaprs-bounces@aprs.net.au</a>
            <br>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ozaprs-bounces@aprs.net.au"><mailto:ozaprs-bounces@aprs.net.au></a>] On Behalf Of
            <br>
                                 Glen English VK1XX
            <br>
                                 Sent: Thursday, 7 December 2017 2:46 PM
            <br>
                                 To: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:ozaprs@aprs.net.au">ozaprs@aprs.net.au</a>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ozaprs@aprs.net.au"><mailto:ozaprs@aprs.net.au></a>
            <br>
                                 Subject: Re: [OZAPRS] Hf gates
            <br>
            <br>
                                 but how does this matter?
            <br>
            <br>
                                 You will  be transmitting on a
            frequency blind
            <br>
            <br>
                                 there will be receivers you cannot
            control
            <br>
            <br>
                                 There will be any number of propagation
            modes you
            <br>
                                 cannot control...
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
                                 On 7/12/2017 3:34 PM, Andrew Rich
            wrote:
            <br>
            <br>
                                     Hi
            <br>
            <br>
                                     Can I get a list of hf gates on
            10.147
            <br>
            <br>
                                     In my planning for the Xmas run
            <br>
            <br>
                                     Cheers
            <br>
            <br>
            _______________________________________________
            <br>
                                 OZAPRS mailing list
            <br>
                                 <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au">OZAPRS@aprs.net.au</a>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au"><mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au></a>
            <br>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs">http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs</a>
            <br>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs"><http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs></a>
            <br>
            <br>
            _______________________________________________
            <br>
                                 OZAPRS mailing list
            <br>
                                 <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au">OZAPRS@aprs.net.au</a>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au"><mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au></a>
            <br>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs">http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs</a>
            <br>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs"><http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs></a>
            <br>
            <br>
            _______________________________________________
            <br>
                             OZAPRS mailing list
            <br>
                             <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au">OZAPRS@aprs.net.au</a>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au"><mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au></a>
            <br>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs">http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs</a>
            <br>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs"><http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs></a>
            <br>
            <br>
            _______________________________________________
            <br>
                             OZAPRS mailing list
            <br>
                             <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au">OZAPRS@aprs.net.au</a>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au"><mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au></a>
            <br>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs">http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs</a>
            <br>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs"><http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs></a>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
                         _______________________________________________
            <br>
                         OZAPRS mailing list
            <br>
                         <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au">OZAPRS@aprs.net.au</a>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au"><mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au></a>
            <br>
                        <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs">http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs</a>
            <br>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs"><http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs></a>
            <br>
            <br>
                         _______________________________________________
            <br>
                         OZAPRS mailing list
            <br>
                         <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au">OZAPRS@aprs.net.au</a>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au"><mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au></a>
            <br>
                        <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs">http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs</a>
            <br>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs"><http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs></a>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
                     _______________________________________________
            <br>
                     OZAPRS mailing list
            <br>
                     <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au">OZAPRS@aprs.net.au</a>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au"><mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au></a>
            <br>
                    <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs">http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs</a>
            <br>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs"><http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs></a>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
                 _______________________________________________
            <br>
                 OZAPRS mailing list
            <br>
                 <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au">OZAPRS@aprs.net.au</a> <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au"><mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au></a>
            <br>
                <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs">http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs</a>
            <br>
                
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs"><http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs></a>
            <br>
                 _______________________________________________
            <br>
                 OZAPRS mailing list
            <br>
                 <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au">OZAPRS@aprs.net.au</a> <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au"><mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au></a>
            <br>
                <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs">http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs</a>
            <br>
                
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs"><http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs></a>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
            <br>
            _______________________________________________
            <br>
            OZAPRS mailing list
            <br>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au">OZAPRS@aprs.net.au</a>
            <br>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs">http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs</a>
            <br>
          </blockquote>
          <br>
          <br>
          _______________________________________________
          <br>
          OZAPRS mailing list
          <br>
          <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au">OZAPRS@aprs.net.au</a>
          <br>
          <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs">http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs</a>
          <br>
          <br>
          <br>
          _______________________________________________
          <br>
          OZAPRS mailing list
          <br>
          <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au">OZAPRS@aprs.net.au</a>
          <br>
          <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs">http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs</a>
          <br>
          <br>
        </blockquote>
        _______________________________________________
        <br>
        OZAPRS mailing list
        <br>
        <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au">OZAPRS@aprs.net.au</a>
        <br>
        <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs">http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs</a>
        <br>
      </blockquote>
      <br>
      <br>
      _______________________________________________
      <br>
      OZAPRS mailing list
      <br>
      <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:OZAPRS@aprs.net.au">OZAPRS@aprs.net.au</a>
      <br>
      <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs">http://lists.aprs.net.au/mailman/listinfo/ozaprs</a>
      <br>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
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