[OZAPRS] Foundation and RF APRS

Mon Dec 23 22:28:21 AEDT 2019

So, from looking at the thread(s) so far:
* Dropping the VK at the start is fine, just put the full callsign in the
comment to cover all your bases.
* Dropping the number from the callsign may cause conflicts between states
and isn't advisable.
* These callsigns are making it out into the APRS-IS network, not being
invalidated and being used and stored, and anyone generating statistics
from these may be incorrect, but there isn't a lot of calls.
* It's great to see F-calls using APRS.

Is it possible for this to be published on the aprs.net.au website, so any
foundation call newbies can feel more welcome?

73,
vk5wtf / vk3tst

On Fri, 20 Dec 2019 at 21:19, vk2tv <vk2tv at exemail.com.au> wrote:

> Scott,
>
> Not OT for me.
>
> Ray vk2tv
>
> On 20/12/19 11:10 pm, Scott Evans wrote:
>
> For the Tier2 servers T2TAS & T2SYDNEY(I'm the sysop of T2TAS) they will
> reject all non verified stations. So if you forget to include your pass
> code then you will be ignored by the server for passing your traffic to the
> internet. I can't answer on behalf of T2QLD or T2PERTH (is that still
> online?) and for any of the ZL (New Zealand) based servers. Whereas I-Gates
> generally don't do any filtering. Only exception to this would be for
> RFONLY NOGATE to destinations.
>
> I realise this is a little bit off the topic, but just wanted to clarify
> the Tier2 internet side of things...
>
> Cheers
>
> VK7HSE Scott Evans
>
> Get Outlook for Android <https://aka.ms/ghei36>
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* OZAPRS <ozaprs-bounces at aprs.net.au> <ozaprs-bounces at aprs.net.au>
> on behalf of Mark Jessop <lenniethelemming at gmail.com>
> <lenniethelemming at gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Friday, December 20, 2019 10:49:05 PM
> *To:* Australian APRS Users <ozaprs at aprs.net.au> <ozaprs at aprs.net.au>
> *Subject:* Re: [OZAPRS] Foundation and RF APRS
>
> For positioning the use of an object is a good way of having a valid
> foundation callsign show up on the various mapping services. As you mention
> it still needs to be sourced from an AX.25 compatible callsign when
> produced via RF, but this could be a modified callsign as mentioned
> previously. If the source callsign is valid from an AX.25 standpoint, then
> it should make its way through igates into APRS-IS fine. Whether packets
> will make their way back *out* of APRS-IS into RF is another good question
> - I'm not sure what IS-RF filtering is used on the various TX-capable
> igates around Australia.
> I'm not sure if any of the commonly available APRS trackers (be it
> standalone devices like the tinytrak/opentracker, or rigs like the various
> kenwoods/yaesus) support emitting of objects instead of position reports,
> so that will be a seriously limiting factor.
> Anyway, the above is a possible option for getting packets out on RF that
> look show up nicely on a map or APRS-capable device and don't require
> additional poking around to find out the actual callsign. However, i
> suspect finding trackers that will produce objects instead of position
> reports may be difficult. (Hopefully I'm wrong on that!)
>
> As for the APRS-IS passcode, well there's also an online calculator here:
> https://apps.magicbug.co.uk/passcode/
> It's just a hash function... I guess the original designers of APRS-IS
> decided security-through-obscurity was good enough :-/
>
> 73
> Mark VK5QI
>
> On Fri, Dec 20, 2019 at 9:55 PM <vk7hse at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> APRS also has the option to add an object to a map, it is with this that
> you could provide the Foundation callsign. In most cases in the US where
> special event stations are in use they are not using the primary ax25
> mycall as a station identifier but instead using the object to place the
> operators valid callsign. Now this doesn’t address the protocol layer
> restriction for ax25, as that’s hard coded and restricted to XXNXXX (or
> variations thereof) As Australian Foundation callsigns (decided to be the
> better choice in 2005) have the XXNXXXX suffix I believe this was chosen
> with the intention to prevent foundation calls from “accidently” trying to
> use packet radio, and if that was the case then it was a bit silly. But it
> is what it is and now that the foundation call is permitted digital modes
> (something I feel they should have always had access to) that decision in
> 2005 has come back to bite them (whoever they were at the time!)
>
>
>
> Granted I haven’t read the determinations to the letter in recent months,
> but a station ID is only required every “TEN” minutes, not on “EVERY”
> transmission! Packet radio was always overkill for that but it was logical
> that the station ID be it’s callsign hence why the ax25 protocol has the
> limit of a 6 letter call.
>
>
>
> Now what can we agree upon in the interim to be acceptable until the
> callsign suffix for the foundation is resolved? Bearing in mind that could
> take some time as there’s now 3 entities involved with the process (WIA,
> AMC & ACMA)
>
>
>
> My take would be a tactical name with the operator callsign in the status
> text field (>VK7FABC John Citizen QE37pa) this would work for all RF aprs
> clients but because of the use of a tactical call it would be prohibited
> into the APRS-IS side (unless you are sneaky and generate a valid aprs pass
> code *the software for that is available under GNU hint think Xastir)
>
>
>
> So that’s my initial thoughts …
>
>
>
> Cheers…
>
>
>
> VK7HSE Scott Evans
>
> *From:* OZAPRS <ozaprs-bounces at aprs.net.au> *On Behalf Of *Jack Schultz
> *Sent:* Friday, 20 December 2019 12:45
> *To:* Australian APRS Users <ozaprs at aprs.net.au>
> *Subject:* Re: [OZAPRS] Foundation and RF APRS
>
>
>
> Hi Marcos (and Carlos), interesting to read both your thoughts on the
> topic.
>
>
>
> Though my preference is obviously to have a 'valid' callsign for AX.25,
> what I use now is the best I could come up with. Every packet contains my
> full callsign in the comment, which I think works well for those that use
> APRS through a PC interface, but not as handy in a mobile rig or handheld
> where my full call is hidden behind several screens.
>
>
>
> My thinking is that while transmitting my full callsign makes it a legal
> transmission, I should try and fit as much as possible in the designated
> callsign field, with the lowest priority being the leftmost part of the
> callsign since it is the least specific.
>
>
>
> I hear a similar take on local repeaters where there is a usual crowd that
> chats to each other, often simply omitting 'VK' altogether when referring
> to each others callsigns, or the callsign of a repeater for example. In the
> world of APRS, I feel there is a similar level of community in that aspect
> within the local RF zone. I generally see a dozen or so core users, so
> there is that immediate recognition when I decode one of their packets.
>
>
>
> In Melbourne I've also seen VK3FSPD using APRS first as VKFSPD, then using
> 3FSPD. I prefer the latter form as it avoids ambiguity when travelling
> interstate.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Jack Schultz
>
> VK3FJTS (3FJTS-7)
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